I think we’re getting there! We’re finding consensus and we’re not ignoring what each other are saying, that can’t be a bad thing.

I also don’t have children, but I teach developmental psychology to parents and social workers. Sometimes there is value to be found in those outside of direct experience and we’re in danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater by grouping everyone together and dismissing everything. Having said that, you’re definitely correct that I don’t have the same lived experience as you, that factors heavily into your passion and your expertise and likewise, I’m reading what you’re saying and listening.

On the Denzel issue — We can just agree Denzel is awesome. We disagree on how much he fights the fight against racism and his way of doing so, I prefer his individualism, you see him as part of a bigger movement… but that doesn’t detract from his core awesomeness.

Bigots generally don’t come around. But bigotry is interesting… it’s thrown around as a catch all term… but the word means ‘a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions’. Bigots are bigots and I meet them all the time. Some are left wing, some are right wing, some are women, some are men, some are black, some are white. Equality means that there’s a shared access to bigotry. However, you’re right, white bigots should be spoken to by non-bigoted whites in the first instance.

However there’s something batshit going on with white people….

Half the white people I know are convinced they aren’t racist (which is impossible from any meaningful understanding of how personality is constructed) and they act as social justice warriors policing anyone they suspect of being a racist. White people can no longer talk to each other about race because they’re all so damn anxious to demonstrate how not racist they are. All it’s doing in my country is making racism harder to de-programme and closing down discussions. Black people are bored of being used as a virtue signal for a certain subset of white privilege. That’s probably not the case where you are cos it sounds a lot more fractious. This is a white person problem and I can see why you’re bored of it. I’m bored of it too — it feeds into my penguinity.

Your last point is one that I find most interesting — it wasn’t snippety at all (though I see why it could be read that way). It was a genuine enquiry into the end point of identity based politics. Modern movements seem to skirt very close to a line… the line between the empowerment of their own group — and the hatred of ‘the other’.

So here’s my question — and you don’t have to answer. Ignoring the newest Texas version of the Black Panther movement (which Bobby Seale has already slammed as a bit of a shit-show) — do you think there’s going to be a return to the Black Panther socialist movement in the same way? Community led intervention etc. I’m a lefty and generally like community led projects — and the panthers always seemed like the logical conclusion to combating Trump and his bullshit. I thought that ‘Trigger Warnings With Killer Mike’ was hinting in that general direction. Maybe it’s already happening and being outside of the USA I don’t see it. Or maybe it feels like #BlackLivesMatter is occupying the same space? I’m interested what you think as I’m fairly convinced that your country is heading for a civil war (because of Trump) and I can see his demagoguery being a huge problem for black Americans.

Thanks for continuing to debate and chat — you’ve given me lots to think about, despite my occasionally combative approach. It makes a refreshing change to exchange ideas in the crucible of disagreement and have to defend our points of view. We still disagree on some stuff but that’s okay, nobody has to win, in the modern world, everyone is set to broadcast and not many discussions go this far, explore issues in this much depth or are half as enjoyable as this one has been.

Cheers for your time, it’s valued and appreciated.